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has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts

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"john h"

Usenet Poster
jf)hawk.nospam@yahoo.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 5:32 AM

Post #1 of 23 (1065 views)
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has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts Not logged in -   Reply 

saw an announcement of SIMCHARTS V 4.0 for use with MS FSX. Their pitch is:
for only $US 59.95 you get access for one year to all their terminal
charts(25000) to download online as you need them They do not sell them on
CD or hardcopy. As an old timer, I myself want the paper enroute charts
folded up on my lap and the approach plate on my kneeboard.. I have hard
time seeing the big picture on a screen. OTH you can call up the chart
during a session and it will display it in a separate window and can also
places the A/C position on the cart.
see
http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?ContentBlockID=6b835581-e26d-4bd2-b214-495977a7d39d&




"Sammy"

Usenet Poster
syousef@bigpond.net.au
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 5:41 AM

Post #2 of 23 (1065 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "john h"] Not logged in -   Reply 

My initial assessment of greed taking this hobby over when I heard
about activation was right.

Almost every publisher and their dog wants yearly subscriptions of
greater than what you were paying for the indefinite use of their
product. The cost of the software for anyone remotely serious about
adding realism's going to shoot through the roof.




"Canuck"

Usenet Poster
ElmoreFudd@LooneyTunes.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 6:27 AM

Post #3 of 23 (1065 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Sammy"] Not logged in -   Reply 

Whats activation got to do with greed. I see it as MS just protecting their
property. The MS spokesman posted at Avsim an answer to the comspiracy
theorists on this topic.
Re charts etc... they cost a lot of money and are in RW updated regularly.
I went to my local airfield and spoke with the pilot school their and they
gladly handed over a huge amount of old charts which were cluttering up the
place. They were glad to be rid of them. When I say old, none were older
than Sept 05. Now I have most of North America in VFR, IFR, Approach and
Departure charts for free.
More of us should do this. We are doing them a favour Smile

"Sammy" <syousef@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:1162723302.295036.153180@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
> My initial assessment of greed taking this hobby over when I heard
> about activation was right.
>
> Almost every publisher and their dog wants yearly subscriptions of
> greater than what you were paying for the indefinite use of their
> product. The cost of the software for anyone remotely serious about
> adding realism's going to shoot through the roof.
>




"Hood2"

Usenet Poster
try@your.own.risk
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 6:31 AM

Post #4 of 23 (1065 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "john h"] Not logged in -   Reply 

Actually I was going to try the Sim charts I already have on CD

"john h" <jf)hawk.nospam@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:A4j3h.2517$l25.2078@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> saw an announcement of SIMCHARTS V 4.0 for use with MS FSX. Their pitch
> is:
> for only $US 59.95 you get access for one year to all their terminal
> charts(25000) to download online as you need them They do not sell them on
> CD or hardcopy. As an old timer, I myself want the paper enroute charts
> folded up on my lap and the approach plate on my kneeboard.. I have hard
> time seeing the big picture on a screen. OTH you can call up the chart
> during a session and it will display it in a separate window and can also
> places the A/C position on the cart.
> see
> http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?ContentBlockID=6b835581-e26d-4bd2-b214-495977a7d39d&
>
>




Dr Teeth

Usenet Poster
no.email.here.please@tardis.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 6:38 AM

Post #5 of 23 (1065 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Canuck"] Not logged in -   Reply 

I was just thinking how wonderful life was, when "Canuck"
<ElmoreFudd@LooneyTunes.com> opened his gob and said:

>Whats activation got to do with greed.

...because the price has not come down as the activation has reduced
piracy (allegedly). It is used to keep the price high.

--
Cheers,

Guy

** Stress - the condition brought about by having to
** resist the temptation to beat the living daylights
** out of someone who richly deserves it.



"RHinNC"

Usenet Poster
rhinnc@[get rid of this] hotmail.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 9:25 AM

Post #6 of 23 (1065 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "The Old Bloke"] Not logged in -   Reply 

 
> Good point. If we believe piracy means honest users have to pay more,
> then
> activation should result in cheaper software.
>
> In Aus, FSX Deluxe costs US$97.50 (AUS$130). Maybe we haven't sent
> enough troops to the Middle East? Smile
>

Valid point. Then we get to pay boatloads for the little extras that used to
come with some products. Take PC's nowadays. Sure we get more bang for your
buck, but 90 day warranties? To get the same warranty as the old price you
will pay close to the same. It is all marketing. Eventually in FS you will
get the game for free, and only pay for per use landings...lol...j/k...but
who knows?





"The Old Bloke"

Usenet Poster
le0pard32@gmail.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 9:26 AM

Post #7 of 23 (1065 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to Dr Teeth] Not logged in -   Reply 

 
"Dr Teeth" <no.email.here.please@tardis.com> wrote in message
news:m7jrk295d9gu6r1fgn0006anm4p475ondn@4ax.com...
>I was just thinking how wonderful life was, when "Canuck"
> <ElmoreFudd@LooneyTunes.com> opened his gob and said:
>
>>Whats activation got to do with greed.
>
> ...because the price has not come down as the activation has reduced
> piracy (allegedly). It is used to keep the price high.
>
> --


Good point. If we believe piracy means honest users have to pay more, then
activation should result in cheaper software.

In Aus, FSX Deluxe costs US$97.50 (AUS$130). Maybe we haven't sent enough
troops to the Middle East? Smile




"The Old Bloke"

Usenet Poster
le0pard32@gmail.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 9:45 AM

Post #8 of 23 (1065 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "RHinNC"] Not logged in -   Reply 

 
"RHinNC" <rhinnc@[get rid of this] hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Tvm3h.17500$HD6.16532@tornado.southeast.rr.com...
>
>> Good point. If we believe piracy means honest users have to pay more,
>> then
>> activation should result in cheaper software.
>>
>> In Aus, FSX Deluxe costs US$97.50 (AUS$130). Maybe we haven't sent
>> enough troops to the Middle East? Smile
>>
>
> Valid point. Then we get to pay boatloads for the little extras that used
> to come with some products. Take PC's nowadays. Sure we get more bang for
> your buck, but 90 day warranties? To get the same warranty as the old
> price you will pay close to the same. It is all marketing. Eventually in
> FS you will get the game for free, and only pay for per use
> landings...lol...j/k...but who knows?
>
>
lol




"Barrie"

Usenet Poster
nothere@elsewhere.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 10:31 AM

Post #9 of 23 (1065 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to Dr Teeth] Not logged in -   Reply 

 
"Dr Teeth" <no.email.here.please@tardis.com> wrote in message
news:m7jrk295d9gu6r1fgn0006anm4p475ondn@4ax.com...
>I was just thinking how wonderful life was, when "Canuck"
> <ElmoreFudd@LooneyTunes.com> opened his gob and said:
>
>>Whats activation got to do with greed.
>
> ...because the price has not come down as the activation has reduced
> piracy (allegedly). It is used to keep the price high.
>
You could buy shares.

Barrie




"Marc Adler"

Usenet Poster
marc.adler@gmail.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 10:42 AM

Post #10 of 23 (1065 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Sammy"] Not logged in -   Reply 

On Nov 5, 4:41 am, "Sammy" <syou...@bigpond.net.au> wrote:

> My initial assessment of greed taking this hobby over when I heard
> about activation was right.

Okay, let me get this straight. You think it's unethical to capitalize
on demand, right?

Marc




Dr Teeth

Usenet Poster
no.email.here.please@tardis.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 10:44 AM

Post #11 of 23 (1065 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Marc Adler"] Not logged in -   Reply 

I was just thinking how wonderful life was, when "Marc Adler"
<marc.adler@gmail.com> opened his gob and said:

>Okay, let me get this straight. You think it's unethical to capitalize
>on demand, right?

It depends on the extent to which it is taken. Don't forget the low
unit cost per boxed game.

Also, just like taxes, the lower the cost, the more money rolls in.

--
Cheers,

Guy

** Stress - the condition brought about by having to
** resist the temptation to beat the living daylights
** out of someone who richly deserves it.



Mxsmanic

Usenet Poster
mxsmanic@gmail.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 1:29 PM

Post #12 of 23 (1062 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "john h"] Not logged in -   Reply 

"john h" <jf)hawk.nospam@yahoo.com> writes:

> saw an announcement of SIMCHARTS V 4.0 for use with MS FSX. Their pitch is:
> for only $US 59.95 you get access for one year to all their terminal
> charts(25000) to download online as you need them They do not sell them on
> CD or hardcopy.

If that's all you want, http://www.skyvector.com does this for free.

> As an old timer, I myself want the paper enroute charts
> folded up on my lap and the approach plate on my kneeboard.. I have hard
> time seeing the big picture on a screen. OTH you can call up the chart
> during a session and it will display it in a separate window and can also
> places the A/C position on the cart.

See above. Essentially the same thing, but free. I guess Jeppesen
doesn't get margins large enough from fleecing real pilots and wants
to soak the sim pilots, too.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.



Mxsmanic

Usenet Poster
mxsmanic@gmail.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 1:31 PM

Post #13 of 23 (1062 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Marc Adler"] Not logged in -   Reply 

Marc Adler writes:

> Okay, let me get this straight. You think it's unethical to capitalize
> on demand, right?

Right.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.



"Barrie"

Usenet Poster
nothere@elsewhere.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 2:13 PM

Post #14 of 23 (1062 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to Mxsmanic] Not logged in -   Reply 

 
> "john h" <jf)hawk.nospam@yahoo.com> writes:
>
>> saw an announcement of SIMCHARTS V 4.0 for use with MS FSX. Their pitch
>> is:
>> for only $US 59.95 you get access for one year to all their terminal
>> charts(25000) to download online as you need them They do not sell them
>> on
>> CD or hardcopy.
>
> If that's all you want, http://www.skyvector.com does this for free.
>
>> As an old timer, I myself want the paper enroute charts
>> folded up on my lap and the approach plate on my kneeboard.. I have hard
>> time seeing the big picture on a screen. OTH you can call up the chart
>> during a session and it will display it in a separate window and can also
>> places the A/C position on the cart.
>
Like you, I like the paper charts, even if they're provided electronically.
The link above is good, thank you, but when I printed the image, it was too
tiny to use, even when zoomed in.

So, I'll look for a source. Actually US$59.95 isn't so bad if they download
as a file to the PC. Then presumably they can be loaded into PaintShop or
somesuch and printed reasonably. However, you say "download online". Maybe
I'll peruse Jeppesen's site and see what's cooking.

But meanwhile, - other priorities, like planning the best way of getting
from Wagga Wagga to Old Sarum and thence to the University of Illinois!!
Smile

Barrie




"Sammy"

Usenet Poster
syousef@bigpond.net.au
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 2:53 PM

Post #15 of 23 (1062 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Canuck"] Not logged in -   Reply 

 
Canuck wrote:
> Whats activation got to do with greed. I see it as MS just protecting their
> property.

You've been drinking the cool aid. Activation basically means that the
software vendor gets to deny you the right to install your software at
any point for any reason. It's protecting their product by threatening
to snatch it away from legitimate users. Once the support period ends
you can't legally install the product. That is greed personified.
Meanwhile the thieves continue to happily pirate with a hack and
download of the full product available on the net before the actual
release date.

> The MS spokesman posted at Avsim an answer to the comspiracy
> theorists on this topic.
> Re charts etc... they cost a lot of money and are in RW updated regularly.

Some people will defend anything.

You won't be happy until you're priced out of the hobby? At this rate,
in 10 years time, a 1 year subscription to the basic sim will cost you
$1000, and the extras you need to make it run realistically with a
decent aircraft will be another $2000/year. Will you be happy then and
continue to extoll the virtues

> I went to my local airfield and spoke with the pilot school their and they
> gladly handed over a huge amount of old charts which were cluttering up the
> place.

Do your charts self destruct in a year? Even if they did and you were
happy to pay for such a thing I would not be.

> They were glad to be rid of them. When I say old, none were older
> than Sept 05. Now I have most of North America in VFR, IFR, Approach and
> Departure charts for free.

Good for you. I'm not talking about what you can get for free.

> More of us should do this. We are doing them a favour Smile

More of us should be doing what exactly? Supporting our local airports?
No issue with that, but some of us don't have money to burn. $100 on a
simulator I can afford, particularly since the hardware I buy doesn't
just get used for simming. Spending as much money as I would to get a
PPL on a sim on the other hand isn't going to happen. I'm no pauper but
I'm neither retired nor affluent. I have other commitments. What makes
the sim great isn't the realism (which is fantastic in some areas and
horrid in others - when's the last time you drove through a taxiway
sign only to have it momentarily dematerialise and your plane came out
unharmed??). We forgive the foibles because it means we all get as
close as we can to the real thing for a reasonable sum of money. What
makes the sim great is accessibility.




"Sammy"

Usenet Poster
syousef@bigpond.net.au
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 2:57 PM

Post #16 of 23 (1062 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Marc Adler"] Not logged in -   Reply 

Marc Adler wrote:
> On Nov 5, 4:41 am, "Sammy" <syou...@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
> Okay, let me get this straight. You think it's unethical to capitalize
> on demand, right?

Okay let me get this straight, you think it's ethical to put words in
my mouth right?

I think its damn unethical to sell a product that's crippled by design
such that the parent company has to be asked for permission every time
it's installed. Especially when product support will eventually be
dropped. Flight simulator has just become a subscription service by
stealth, and who knows what the subscription period is.

I think it's unethical to sell yearly subscriptions to a product that
inflate it's cost to the end user many fold. I think these companies
are basically shooting themselves in the foot because when the average
man on the street has to spend a significant portion of their income to
get the product, no one will buy it. Then these companies will be
forced to dump the product (after having grabbed a quick buck).

This whole hobby is going to hell in a hand basket and people are
cheering it on.




"Marc Adler"

Usenet Poster
marc.adler@gmail.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 5:06 PM

Post #17 of 23 (1062 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Sammy"] Not logged in -   Reply 

On Nov 5, 1:57 pm, "Sammy" <syou...@bigpond.net.au> wrote:

> Okay let me get this straight, you think it's ethical to put words in
> my mouth right?

It was a question. That's what that curly thing at the end above the
period indicates.

> Flight simulator has just become a subscription service by
> stealth, and who knows what the subscription period is.

Well, these are all predictions, and I didn't ask to see your crystal
ball.

> I think these companies
> are basically shooting themselves in the foot because when the average
> man on the street has to spend a significant portion of their income to
> get the product, no one will buy it. Then these companies will be
> forced to dump the product (after having grabbed a quick buck).

If you really think MS is going to dump FS... Okay, nevermind. I get
the picture.

Marc




"Sammy"

Usenet Poster
syousef@bigpond.net.au
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 7:58 PM

Post #18 of 23 (1062 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Marc Adler"] Not logged in -   Reply 

Marc Adler wrote:
> On Nov 5, 1:57 pm, "Sammy" <syou...@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
> If you really think MS is going to dump FS... Okay, nevermind. I get
> the picture.

Please don't try and make me out as some kind of radical crackpot. I'm
sure the same was said of the combat flight sim series, which they
killed at 3. Microsoft, like any company will dump any product when it
becomes a liability. At the present time FSX is a showcase product.
However if it doesn't sell...




"Canuck"

Usenet Poster
ElmoreFudd@LooneyTunes.com
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 8:05 PM

Post #19 of 23 (1062 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Sammy"] Not logged in -   Reply 

Errr... I read a post somewhere today which led to a link at MS. They are
hiring already for the next MSFS. Aha here it is
http://members.microsoft.com/careers/search/details.aspx?JobID=FF705E84-F81B-4F3B-AFAA-B3D33F95D1AA&start=1&interval=10&SortCol=DatePosted

"Sammy" <syousef@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:1162774726.392251.173800@m7g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
> Marc Adler wrote:
>> On Nov 5, 1:57 pm, "Sammy" <syou...@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
>> If you really think MS is going to dump FS... Okay, nevermind. I get
>> the picture.
>
> Please don't try and make me out as some kind of radical crackpot. I'm
> sure the same was said of the combat flight sim series, which they
> killed at 3. Microsoft, like any company will dump any product when it
> becomes a liability. At the present time FSX is a showcase product.
> However if it doesn't sell...
>




"Sammy"

Usenet Poster
syousef@bigpond.net.au
Posted on:
Nov 5, 2006, 10:16 PM

Post #20 of 23 (1061 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Hood2"] Not logged in -   Reply 

I wrote a message and it seems to have disappeared into the ether. My
apologies if it appears and roughly the same message is therefore
posted twice.

I doubt Microsoft will can Flight Sim before one more iteration. They'd
have to have abysmal sales or general public embarassment out of a
showcase product before they did so. However one or two iterations into
the future who knows...

It's been done before. MS Train Simulator was canned. Though there was
no official announcement canning Combat Flight Sim 4, take a look at
these unsubstantiated rumours that it was canned just before beta:

http://www.simhq.com/simhq3/sims/boards/bbs/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=148;t=000021

Popular games have been canned before. It's business after all.




Mxsmanic

Usenet Poster
mxsmanic@gmail.com
Posted on:
Nov 6, 2006, 2:33 AM

Post #21 of 23 (1061 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Sammy"] Not logged in -   Reply 

Sammy writes:

> It's been done before. MS Train Simulator was canned.

Train Simulator was a really crummy product. Not so much the best of
all train simulators as the least bad of all train simulators. There
still aren't any decent train simulators out there, but the demand is
probably a lot smaller than it is for aviation simulation.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.



"FlyingAxx (Axel)"

Usenet Poster
FlyingAxx@gmx.net
Posted on:
Nov 6, 2006, 2:32 PM

Post #22 of 23 (1059 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "Canuck"] Not logged in -   Reply 

Canuck wrote:
> Errr... I read a post somewhere today which led to a link at MS. They are
> hiring already for the next MSFS. Aha here it is
> http://members.microsoft.com/careers/search/details.aspx?JobID=FF705E84-F81B-4F3B-AFAA-B3D33F95D1AA&start=1&interval=10&SortCol=DatePosted
<...>

For me it sounds awful: "Additional areas of responsibility may
include: implementation of vehicle panels and instrumentation
systems, audio, effect triggers, and _low-level AI controllers_ for
the vehicles." What does that mean - leaving the AI on its low level
as it is?
--
Regards
Axel



juiceman96

New User
Member Since: Oct 2004
1 posts

Posted on:
Nov 29, 2007, 4:40 AM

Post #23 of 23 (723 views)
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Re: has anyone used the new Jeppesen simcharts [In reply to "john h"] Not logged in -   Reply 

Listen up yo. To live in this world market we are going to see this crap all the time. And you all talk like this is something new. It's supply and demand my fellow pilots. No more no less. They will always see how much you will pay and charge you 10% more. You work hard enough on this internet and you'll get what you want for free. You just have to work on it. And then keep it to yourself. You let the flood gates open and it's over. Adios.


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